Dolomitic lime

burnie

New member
OK , just hit up Lowes , Home DePot and WallyWorld . No dolomitic lime to be found . Ended up with a bag of fast acting lime.....not "quick" lime . It`s pelletized like garden fertilizer for potatoes . Has directions for yard , garden and potted plants . Is this ok to use at thier called for rate of 1 tbs per 12" pot ? Or should I wait to find dolomitic lime ? BTW , this will be mixed into 3 gallon root pouches of ProMix with mycho . To be fed organically . Thanks !!

peace...burnie
 
I'd go with oyster shell flour ............can get a bag from Peaceful Valley for cheap........

late................
 
Annaba , didn`t mean to come off that way . Meant to say this pelletized/coated lime is very similar ( texture wise ) to the old 10-10-10 fertilizer we used to put down in rows before cut potatoes were put in .
 
have any of you guys ever planted yams, I'm addicted to my sweet reds and was wondering if they grow in the heat of florida summers...
 
I'm talkin sweet taters, I thought they were the same as yams...thanks...gonna do a little research and then mebbe give 'em a go...
 
thanks for the offer but I'm not gonna be able to do much diggin for mebbe 3 months, I'm not poppin stitches and staples like I did last time, but after that I'd love to try my hand at planting slips...I actually began compostin...whoda thunk
 
what I've read recently very unlikely you will find true yams in the US outside Caribbean markets. All sweet potatoes
 
I'd go with oyster shell flour ............can get a bag from Peaceful Valley for cheap........

late................

I second this. Oyster shells should be like 97% or higher pure CaCo3. Super great source of calcium IMO. I'm going to pass on dolomite lime, and any other lime source from now on. Too much Mg usually or some other low grade source of calcium I feel like. I could be wrong. Either way, the local farm and garden store I recently became a huge fan of sells a 50# oyster shell bag for like $11.
 
They're both Calcium Carbonate actually. Oyster shell is jus Calcium, dolimitic lime is Ca an Mg, typically in a 4:1 ratio...which is ideal fer soil. Dolomitic lime is also typically much cheaper an easier to source as well.

50lb bag round here is typically $3-4.

They're both calcium carbonate but I was under the impression the oyster shells had more calcium. Still makes me wonder if it using dolomite might add too much Mg to the soil. The resources I have suggest you want to aim for 5-6.5:1 Ca:Mg.
 
Fer field crops in a heavy soil, that is a good ratio. Fer pottin soil, 4:1 is a good ratio. Fer hydro, 2-3:1 is yer goal. Pretty much the lighter the medium, the lower the ratio...IMO.

Care to elaborate why the ratio changes between mediums?
 
Wish I could, but I honestly don't understand it to that degree.


Hmm... I'm just struggling to understand why it would change. From what I recently read it would be optimal, at least in soil, to keep it in the ideal range regardless if it is potted plant or not. To me it is about keeping the primary and secondary macros in proper ratio to increase uptake of the plant and limit lockouts. I would think a plant in a smaller pot would just need to be fed lesser amounts but more frequently. I think of it like hydro. Keeping the pH in check in a small rez, say a couple gallons, will ALWAYS be harder than keeping them in check in a larger rez. Not saying it can't be done, I just think it is harder. 4:1 or even 1:1 will probably work but from what I've seen about soil tests, and proper levels in the soil, too much Mg just isn't optimal. Just like K, or even P. Specially when we are talking about ranges for calcium being 600-4000, and Mg is 60-480 (480 is pretty close to 600). I use to think higher numbers would be better but after the stuff I read recently I'm ditching all that crap. In this organic thing I read that was like 32 pages in PDF format, it suggested Ca:Mg = 6.5:1, Ca:K 13:1, and Mg:K 2:1. Ironically, that is exactly what is suggested by people growing 'high brix.'

I'm not saying you're wrong, Annaba, just trying to make sense of everything. Obviously I'm still new to all this and easily influenced. This is just where I ended up after taking the advice about less is more and doing soil testing.

Oh, and a couple links for some of the resources I was reading.
http://www.cefs.ncsu.edu/resources/organicproductionguide/soilfertilityfinaljan09.pdf
http://www.soilminerals.com/soiltest_page1.htm
http://msue.anr.msu.edu/news/anions_and_cations_in_plants_oh_my_but_why_do_we_care
 
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Don't over do with lime.
> pH 6,2 phosphorus get unavailable for plants.

Dolomite is just natural lime with 5-15% MgO.
You can take any lime / lava with > 5% MgO.
Up to 2kg / M3
 
Yeah, soil should be ~6.8 and it's actually better to be right at or just over 7 into flowering, with dolomite lime and peat moss you'll stay right at 6.8 all the time, which is close enough to perfect.

I use dolomite lime, oyster shell does not have mg and I don't want to chance having a deficiency. I've used dolomite on the same soil for over a decade and never had an issue with too much or too little mg.
 
Lotta variables gonna determine the pH of soil with peat an dolomitic lime...to jus say it's gonna be 6.8 is kinda crazy, don't ya think?

Curious why yer comment on the 7 er jus over fer flower too?

Nope, peat and lime will be 6.8 over a fairly broad range of variables. I've put together at least 20 grows, including one for a Boulder dispensary, and with a peat based soil the pH is always 6.8.

I also use Earth Juice nutes, which are very acidic... most organic nutes will be acidic mixed in water... So organic ferts + the biologic activity in the soil tends toward acid, but the carbonates on the lime need to be depleted quite a bit for the pH to fall below 6.8. What the lime is doing is buffering the pH so despite the addition of acidic material to the soil the pH can stay constant. This means the lime needs to be replenished as it's used up, but because it's a buffer you can add quite a bit of lime and the pH will stay at 6.8.

The idiots who own the dispensary in Boulder thought they needed to raise the pH of the nute solution I use for watering and despite only raising it to 6.5 it still, over time, caused the pH of the soil to start raising above 7. They didn't understand that it's not the pH of the water, it's the amount of buffering capacity of the soil that's actually important, and by adding alkaline material to the soil they managed to kill the pH balance of the soil by watering a nute solution pH'ed up to 6.5. I caught it with a soil test and knew right away they were pHing the nute solution. They seem shocked that I knew when I asked them why they were doing it when I did not tell them to.

It's just not the same as hydroponics... and that's why people say you never need to check the pH of an organic system, and why doing so and trying to adjust things can create problems.

As far as the pH being just over 7, that's the ideal range for nute uptake in flowering cannabis plants in soil. 6.8 works just fine too.
 
Als zodanig is er geen gebrek aan kennis.
Er is alleen ontkenning, van de steen tot aan de profeet.


Trans:
As such, there is no lack of knowledge.
There is only denial, from the stone to the prophet.

Christian Morgenstern. :dancer:


The differance between soil and hydro is only marginal:
Translate from Canna.nl

PH and EC

What is the importance of the pH-rate?

The acidity (pH) influences the availability of the various nutrients for the plants. You ensure, therefore, that the pH always remains within the proper range. Optimum availability of nutrients in the substrate is at a pH of 5.2 to 6.2.

CANNA however recommends different pH limits for different substrates:
• TERRA: 5.8 to 6.2
• COCO: 5.5 to 6.2
• Other: 5.2 to 6.2
 
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An old Dutch saying is: Lime makes rich farmers and poor sons.
Ca forces +ions of the clay/humus complex, that gives a soil that is empty.
(except for Ca)

Balance is the Key!

The most graphic illustration of the interaction of essential elements is called a Mulders Chart (Figure 1). This chart demonstrates the effect that some elements have on the availability of others to the plant. Some elements work in synergy — they stimulate the uptake of others and increase their availability. Some elements are antagonistic — they interfere with the uptake or availability of others. In addition, excessive applications of some elements can result in binding with others, causing lockups and making the latter unavailable; for example, excess liming (calcium) affects the availability of magnesium, zinc, iron, potassium, and manganese.

It’s important to understand the influence of balanced nutrition. Two plants can be grown at the same time yet yield different results. One might be grown in sand and one in a good garden loam. Both are planted at the same time. The end result might be one is small because it had a limited supply of nutrients and other large because it had a good supply, both plants, though will be healthy and normal because they had a balanced supply of nutrients. Health and normality can be present without optimal development having taken place. It’s all a matter of what you put into the plant and how you do it.

In short, you can use all the N-P-K you want, you will see the plant “grow” but this has little to do with plant health. To me, it is absurd to even consider reproducing nature’s food for healthy plants solely in a lab, when the world’s leading botanists tell us how little we know about how plants actually grow. This is why, even with all of our fertilizer programs, we always include natural inputs with any chemical inputs: humates, fish and seaweed, and carbon, and those that support soil fertility, microbial activity and plant health and that buffer chemical inputs. Consider chemical inputs as tools that you can learn to use to enhance your situation and profitability, providing you understand the correct way to use them.

Other practices like soil testing, plant tissue testing, crop rotation, microbe counts, and continual education all contribute to building a long-term sustainable program, and I encourage growers to consider these on an ongoing basis. People, like home gardeners, who may not do soil or tissue testing, cannot possibly know, or be expected to know, what specific elements are required and in what ratios. They are exposed to a huge range of products in pretty packets, so they continue to, collectively, spend billions of dollars on products they do not completely understand.

Conclusion
So, balance is the key. Prior to applying chemical fertilizers or biocides, ask yourself, “Will nature approve?” Does it make sense to continually use any single product year after year, or continually spray toxic chemicals because of constant bug or disease infestations? Given that fungal spores latch onto the surface of weak plants, would it not make sense to strengthen the plant instead of continually spraying fungicides?

If your situation does not include or warrant proper test procedures, find out about what you are using and question whether it contributes or detracts from soil and plant health long term. At the end of the day, whatever we put on our soil ends up in our mouths. And given that in Australia (and I suspect in North America, too) degenerative diseases like hearth disease, cancer, and obesity have dramatically increased over the last 100 years, shouldn’t we look at what we were eating 100 years ago as an indicator or guide to better health? Are we using chemicals as a tool or are they dictating our habits? From my experience, when plants with good nutrition are challenged, they generally recover.

https://sp.yimg.com/ib/th?id=HN.608011780074964064&pid=15.1&P=0
 

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