Terpene ratios- database?

organic alchemist

organic alchemist

researcher
Howdy folks, Im wondering if anyone knows of any database where different terp ratios from tests are held/ shared?

Im looking into the ways fert additives affect flavor profiles and wether or not this is a big thing or not..

I have gotten so much weed in the last 1.5 yrs from different sources due to the explosion of unregulated dispensaries in my area ( mohawk territory ON) i live about 20 mins away.

I first encountered the fake lavender/ rosewater flavor in a master yoda. And then it popped up in a gg 4. I thought wow thats a strong flavor from 2 diff strains. Then a fake lemon/ pine thing with harsh flavor pops up in a few strains...

Im just wondering if my hypothesis is correct that these types of overbearing flavor additives could be detected by comparing terp ratios from samples and looking for trends.

Im hoping i can at least satisfy my own curiosity and run a few tests to see whats going on. Its really pissing me off seeing this stuff around.


Any thoughts or ideas , links to collection of terp results are appreciated.

Peace

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OA, I'm also interested in this and have had no luck in my searches. So many unknowns with our favorite plant!
 
I haven't done much experimentation but I can tell you from having terpene tests done that the ratios can vary a lot from crop to crop. I do think additives could boost the levels of certain terpenes (the Botanicare sweet lines come to mind). I suspect tests would show those buds to have a flat terpene profile with just a few terpenes in high amounts and not much else. Good organics have diverse profile with sometimes over 20 different terpenes being detected. Each strain seems to have a few terpenes that dominate with a cast of minor players which makes the strains natural profile. I suspect additives will boost whatever and may actually clash with the natural profile, which is what I think you have experienced.
 
Professor Iglofski said:
I haven't done much experimentation but I can tell you from having terpene tests done that the ratios can vary a lot from crop to crop. I do think additives could boost the levels of certain terpenes (the Botanicare sweet lines come to mind). I suspect tests would show those buds to have a flat terpene profile with just a few terpenes in high amounts and not much else. Good organics have diverse profile with sometimes over 20 different terpenes being detected. Each strain seems to have a few terpenes that dominate with a cast of minor players which makes the strains natural profile. I suspect additives will boost whatever and may actually clash with the natural profile, which is what I think you have experienced.
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The levels change in my experience but the general profile is consistent per cultivar. Additives do add gross IMHO favor to the plants they would not be found by growing in soil. The microbes in soil can effect terpenes as well. In a good way. Adding sugar water flavored with ‘flavorings’ is asking for trouble with my taste.
Great discussion.
-joe
 
Professor Iglofski said:
I haven't done much experimentation but I can tell you from having terpene tests done that the ratios can vary a lot from crop to crop. I do think additives could boost the levels of certain terpenes (the Botanicare sweet lines come to mind). I suspect tests would show those buds to have a flat terpene profile with just a few terpenes in high amounts and not much else. Good organics have diverse profile with sometimes over 20 different terpenes being detected. Each strain seems to have a few terpenes that dominate with a cast of minor players which makes the strains natural profile. I suspect additives will boost whatever and may actually clash with the natural profile, which is what I think you have experienced.
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100% this , if youve profiled the strain under certain conditions then there should be a +/- for each compound . an addituve would possibly just boost a few known terps and looking at the ratios between them you could possibly identify them in a sample. I have one of the lavender / rosewater ones to have tested in the near future.

Peas

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Joe Dirt said:
The levels change in my experience but the general profile is consistent per cultivar. Additives do add gross IMHO favor to the plants they would not be found by growing in soil. The microbes in soil can effect terpenes as well. In a good way. Adding sugar water flavored with ‘flavorings’ is asking for trouble with my taste.
Great discussion.
-joe
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Im happy you guys agree with me :)
Everyone thinks im crazy around here. Ive always grown like 75-100% organic , and havent smoked tobacco in like 15 yrs so i can analyze flavors well. These fake ones stand out a lot, and sometimes i cant tell until i get home lol. I love trying new kinds but can ruin the buying experience.

Peas

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My friends who grow the latest and greatest genetics have many cuts that smell fake. They are not. The fruity, tutti, sour, kushy, candy smells are unlike anything I've ever seen before. Often multiple layers, fruit first, then sweet candy, then kush. Very complex and way more exciting compared to parent stock (gg4, cookies, wedding cake, dosidos, orange, etc)

My opinion is that the current wave of new genetics is truly a whole nother game compared to what we know. All traits seem to be locked in; smell, appearance, density, flavor, and effect. We smoking super weed now folks, it may be fake flavors up by you but over the last 2 years around here there has been a rise in real bud that smells fake it so good.

There was some shady shit going on when the dispensaries were operating in kinda a gray zone. Think added flavors/terps occurred back then. Now in legalization the weed is so good you better have the next sought after cut or risk becoming old news overnight!
 
Annaba said:
Not disagreein with anything said, but keep in mind, this is business, an business is not about what you like, it's about what sells, it's about what the larger audience likes...I struggle with that myself someimes, but that's business.

With that bein said, I hope you can make your numbers runnin soil grown organic weed an wish ya the best.
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I never said were growing organic :) ive seen great natural terps from lots of chem lines with only slight bad flavor with overuse. But these new things are something where each strain loses its unique terps and they all taste the same. These super crappy flavors are probably grown by industrian gangsters that crank out fortune cookies, jamaican sugar, m39 , insert whatever mass grown crap turned out in 6 weeks. They can now sauce it up to compensate for their lack of growing skill.

Im planning on growing ( to start) with the oldest most well known chem ferts that are widely used in greenhouse and horticulture , its business i know. Used properly and flushed well with a couple organic additives i know it can provide authentic flavors.

Someday maybe try a room organic as a comparison if i can..also i think greenhouses would be organic when built in future. im there to make them money and fast. Its a day job and if i dont keep them happy they find someone else. I see alot of companies that focus too much on being special out the gate, trying to be innovative when they havent paid the bills. Were starting with a proven simple system and then once were getting the returns we need, we can maybe branch out a bit.


Peas



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Reed Man said:
My friends who grow the latest and greatest genetics have many cuts that smell fake. They are not. The fruity, tutti, sour, kushy, candy smells are unlike anything I've ever seen before. Often multiple layers, fruit first, then sweet candy, then kush. Very complex and way more exciting compared to parent stock (gg4, cookies, wedding cake, dosidos, orange, etc)

My opinion is that the current wave of new genetics is truly a whole nother game compared to what we know. All traits seem to be locked in; smell, appearance, density, flavor, and effect. We smoking super weed now folks, it may be fake flavors up by you but over the last 2 years around here there has been a rise in real bud that smells fake it so good.

There was some shady shit going on when the dispensaries were operating in kinda a gray zone. Think added flavors/terps occurred back then. Now in legalization the weed is so good you better have the next sought after cut or risk becoming old news overnight!
Click to expand...
I dont know if i believe that all of a sudden there are multiple strains that crank out an thrills gum flavor like this . ive grown and seen some of the newer strains . testing will tell, i kept a sample that is thrills gum in a bowl.

The last part of your post hits home, this is not tested legal weed im talking about. Once grown in a legal environment i think these products cant be used. .

Anyways time will tell and its a small percentage of stuff right now.

I freaking love some of the new crazy terped out shit with the complex skunky garbage cookie dough#! These 2 fake flavors stand out in only some product so not everyone is using it.

Peas

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Reedman, what are the names on the new wave clones so i can watch for them! I know we get some high end bc stuff still that i never have a problem with.

I tired angel cake, pink sunset, gelato, peanut breath , meat breath, bannana breath etc.

The pink sunset smelled like a trash can dipped in kush but smoked much better than the smell.

Peas



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There seems to be a lot of adulterated concentrates floating around, including legal product from local dispensaries. It is similar to the wine market, in that there are blended jug wines with flavors added and estate grand cru's to match all tastes and pocket books.

I've seen terpene by strain bar charts, but none with empirical numbers.

I also know for a fact that you can change the odor/flavor profile by choice of plant food, from my friend growing cannabis using orchid fertilizer during the late 60's and giving it distinctive flavor, in retrospect probably elevating the Linalool levels.

Dr Justin Fischedick did his post doctoral studies on plant terpenes and is who's brain I pick when looking for studies and resources on terpenes.

https://www.theemeraldconference.com/conference_speaker/justin-fischedick/

If you will contact me at [email protected], I will try to initiate a three way conversation on the subject via email.
 
OA, honestly many of the names escape me, it's gotten pretty wild but basically it's just OBS Genetics, franchise, rascal genetics, JB genetics, and other new top breeders and stuff recombined most times.

I'm not saying it's the most orthodox approach to breeding , but when they start with base genetics of the best in USA and then cross a winning female to another strains males, almost everything that comes out is keeper quality, Even from a first time breeding.

Some exceptional names that I remember are fruity pebbles, sherbbles, lime 43, orange sherbert, orange cookies, Skittlez, white urkel, etc. Even a good romulan sometimes. And the live resin from these.... This stuff is nucking futz! Good luck getting hands on....the ppl holding this stuff is tight and expensive (like a good hooker should be!) :applause:

I'm not sure what thrills gum tastes like....other than it says online it tastes like soap. Sorry I thought it was like a bubblegummy fruity yummy flavor. The buds I mention are the latter, hehe
 
One thing I do is google lab testes for certain cultivars.
Most are public. Especially in the legal regulated markets.
‘Blue dream cannabis lab test’
There is lots of public info. :takin_picture:
 
Old Congo/THH sauce............flavorful and x10 dab rush........85gr first run.....

best I’ve had in concentrates.....no harshness/burn or funky taste.....
 
Reed Man said:
OA, honestly many of the names escape me, it's gotten pretty wild but basically it's just OBS Genetics, franchise, rascal genetics, JB genetics, and other new top breeders and stuff recombined most times.

I'm not saying it's the most orthodox approach to breeding , but when they start with base genetics of the best in USA and then cross a winning female to another strains males, almost everything that comes out is keeper quality, Even from a first time breeding.

Some exceptional names that I remember are fruity pebbles, sherbbles, lime 43, orange sherbert, orange cookies, Skittlez, white urkel, etc. Even a good romulan sometimes. And the live resin from these.... This stuff is nucking futz! Good luck getting hands on....the ppl holding this stuff is tight and expensive (like a good hooker should be!) :applause:

I'm not sure what thrills gum tastes like....other than it says online it tastes like soap. Sorry I thought it was like a bubblegummy fruity yummy flavor. The buds I mention are the latter, hehe
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I can say ive tried a bunch of those and enjoy them for sure!

I just got some zkittlez and layer cake ( wedding cake x tk skunk from jb)

Great smoke!

I wouldnt say the new strains are more terpy than good selections in the 90s when i was growing up in high school.
Bubble gum , skunk, romulan , hashplant, afghani, durban, hawaiian all had great strong terps back in the day..
I do agree that the new strains do have more traits locked in , selection is easier and unique combinations are constantly being produced.

I can rule out that the floral thrills gum tasting samples are just new strains with terps im not used to. In online reports cookie dough does not have a lavender or floral flavor.

Its definitly use/ overuse of some sort of ferts, they do look great though and are always high end strains. The fake pine / lemon smell is associated with a lower quality product.

Peas


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Graywolf said:
There seems to be a lot of adulterated concentrates floating around, including legal product from local dispensaries. It is similar to the wine market, in that there are blended jug wines with flavors added and estate grand cru's to match all tastes and pocket books.

I've seen terpene by strain bar charts, but none with empirical numbers.

I also know for a fact that you can change the odor/flavor profile by choice of plant food, from my friend growing cannabis using orchid fertilizer during the late 60's and giving it distinctive flavor, in retrospect probably elevating the Linalool levels.

Dr Justin Fischedick did his post doctoral studies on plant terpenes and is who's brain I pick when looking for studies and resources on terpenes.

https://www.theemeraldconference.com/conference_speaker/justin-fischedick/

If you will contact me at [email protected], I will try to initiate a three way conversation on the subject via email.
Click to expand...
I think youve hit the nail on the head. Something fert wise pushing the linalool levels up. All the samples ive seen like this are high end and look great. Some samples are worse than others with the worst one being cookie dough which i lve saved to have it tested for 20 terps,


I appreciate your offer to speak with your friend. Would like to learn more about this but need to brush up on the subject before i take it further..
I would love to someday have my own simple gc/ fid to run terps just for my own research but if my friend is working in a local lab i dont need to. Hoping he can process a few samples for me in the new year. The next step would be to go out dispensary hopping and find more of the crap im talking about, run them and look for similarities in the samples with the flavors i find suspect. Should be fun!!

Peas


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